Chapter 16: A PhD and Teaching Leadership Theory and Policy after Retirement
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Description
In this chapter, Dr. Ecung first explains her decision (in 2010) to get a PhD and then talks about teaching Leadership Theory after her retirement in 2016.
First she explains how she came to earn a PhD at Our Lady of the Lake University at San Antonio after that institution established a cohort in Houston in 2010. She talks about her husband, Ramone’s support of her work and the challenges of doing a PhD (conferred 2013) while involved in a demanding position. She recalls her graduation.
Dr. Ecung then discusses the impact of her program of study as she served as Associate VP and VP of Clinical Operations.
Next, she explains how she was invited to teach leadership theory and policy after her retirement. She explains that she wants to give back to the University and this is her contribution of community service.
Finally, she notes that her heroine is her mother.
Identifier
EcungWB_C16
Publication Date
2-27-2017
City
Houston, Texas
Interview Session
Wenonah Ecung, PhD, Oral History Interview, February 27, 2017
Topics Covered
The Interview Subject's Story - Post-Retirement Activities; Professional Path; The Educator; The Leader; The Mentor; Activities Outside Institution; Career and Accomplishments; Post Retirement Activities; Professional Values, Ethics, Purpose; Evolution of Career; Professional Practice; The Professional at Work; Leadership; On Leadership; Mentoring; On Mentoring
Creative Commons License
This work is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-Noncommercial-No Derivative Works 3.0 License.
Disciplines
History of Science, Technology, and Medicine | Oncology | Oral History
Transcript
Wenonah Ecung, PhD:
I didn't know that wasokay, I'd be happy to. As I mentioned, there was a point where I could execute on my role with my eyes closed, if you will. And so it was important to me not to be bored. There was a program that I had looked at for about 10 years, from a distance. And it was a leadership program. They were offering a PhD in leadership. It was Our Lady of the Lake University, and they were out of San Antonio. And I had looked at it 10 years prior to actually entering, but I had, at that time, still one young kid at home. I knew with her still there, I could not make a commute to San Antonio every other weekend. So I put it on the back burner. And then, in 2010, yeah, it was 2010, I got wind that they were going to start a cohort here in Houston. And I applied. That was back in June. No, it was in the spring. It was in the spring of 2010. I applied, you had to take several psychological tests. You had to interview with a panel. You had to do a written essay, timed essay, after reading an excerpt on something. Mine was Y2K. And I ended up getting accepted to the program, started in August, 2010. It was everything10 years ago, I had looked at the curriculum and thought, wow, this is what I do. This would enhance me. I want this. And got in, and it was one of the best decisions I've made. I had just gotten remarried in 2008, and thisone of the impetus for going ahead with this was, I had remarried, Ramon is my second husbandand the last(laughter)
Tacey Ann Rosolowski, PhD :
It's always good to be able to say that!
Wenonah Ecung, PhD:
And he, at that time, was working on his master's in engineering. And I found myself doing a lot of what he wasdoing a lot of reading with him on his subject matter. And I thought, if I'm doing this, I could be doing something for myself. And that was part ofand he was very supportive. So I got accepted. And it took a tremendous amount of time away from the new marriage. But he was truly my partner in this, because I would usually get up about 5:00, I'd put in an hour at this table, studying. I'd get dressed, go to work, I'd get home about 7:00, we'd eat. And then around 9:00, I'd come back to this table. And if I didn't feel like it, he'd say, "Go to your workspace." And that's what I would do. And he'd disappear somewhere in the house. And I would usually work until about 12:00 midnight, and I did that for about four consecutive years of a new marriage. And I asked him about it, and he says, well, he knew it would change. But I think that says a lot about him to endure like that. And then I was at graduation in San Antonio. And the chair was pinning one of the medallions on me, of the program. And she said, "How would you like to teach?" And my chair of my committee, Dr. Green, who I just loved dearly, she said, "Mark"she called him Markshe said, "Mark told me that you might be interested in teaching. How would you like to teach?" [ ] When she asked me, I said, as I told Ramon, I didn't feel like I could say no. So I said, "Of course! Yes!" And that was December 13th. [ ] I graduated on December 13 in 2014. [ ] And I started teaching in January.
Tacey Ann Rosolowski, PhD :
Wow.
Wenonah Ecung, PhD:
Yeah.
Tacey Ann Rosolowski, PhD :
Wow, that's neat. So tell me what youyou said when you were looking at that program over those 10 years, saying wow, this is what I do. So how did that program enable you to develop? What directions did it take you in?
Wenonah Ecung, PhD:
Well, I was able to use it at work. It's heavily-concentrated in theory. One of the nice things about me going through the program was that we did acquire Ethan Dmitrovsky, our Provost, kind of while I was going through the program. And Ethan is extremely knowledgeable about different theories. And so as he would mention things, I would quietly know I was studying about it, and maybe it wasn't quite the way he was asserting. But we were able to have talks about emotional intelligence and the importance of leadership. We were able to have discussions on what we needed to do to help mentor our new division heads that we were bringing. He understood what Servant Leadership was. I remember, I think it wasI don't know whether it was Mendelsohn or DePinho, but one of the two presidents had all of his direct reports. He wanted them to read Greenleaf's book on servant leadership. Well, I had already read it, studied it, written about it. And I know it was with Burke at that time. I remember saying to him, "If you want, I can do the Cliff Notes for you." I knew when I looked at the curriculum, it was something that I'd be using in everyday life, contributing to, or making me better, or helping me understand how I move through some things, that maybe occurred naturally, and I didn't know why or how. But then suddenly there it was, and there was research attached to it, which validated it.
Tacey Ann Rosolowski, PhD :
So what are you teaching?
Wenonah Ecung, PhD:
So my moment was --I knew we had this conversation, and then it hit me; we didn't have the recorder on. Because I was thinking, Tacey doesn't remember? (laughter) You can edit that out.
Tacey Ann Rosolowski, PhD :
No, that's all right, that's
Wenonah Ecung, PhD:
So anyway, I teach Leadership Assessment. I'm sorry, I teach Leadership Theory, which goes through a host of different theories, like leader member exchange, servant leadership, emotional intelligence, full-range model of leadership. I teach that. I teach Policy I and Policy II. And then this semester, I've picked upI was teaching one course at a time, because I was also working. And my desire was not to teach more than one course at a time. And then Dr. Green, who was my committee chair, who would fly up here, because it's an in-class program. [ ] He had surgery, he had hip surgery and developed blood clots, and for this year could not fly to Houston, or drive to Houston. So I was honored when he reached out to me and asked me to teach his class. That was, like, icing on the cake. I have not met anyone that hasn't fallen in love with Dr. Green. He is just a phenomenalhe is the type of professor that makes you, as an alum , just because he's there, you want to give back to the school. And that was really what I wanted to do. I wanted to give [back]. And it wasn't just Dr. Green, it was Dr. Green and Dr. Gergen, and Dr. [Ree], the statistician, and Dr. [Sun] and Dr. Duncan. I had never experienced professors in all the programs, and I've not been afraid of school, these people were phenomenal. And it was lots of hard work, but if you were willing to put it in, they were willing to stand beside you. And I had such a desire to be like them, to give back that way. So this is my community service, because it sure doesn't pay anything.
Tacey Ann Rosolowski, PhD :
Yeah. Well, and I can only imagine how valuable it would be, given the depth of your experience. Because you can really contextualize the book learning, if you will, with amazing real-world scenarios.
Wenonah Ecung, PhD:
Right. And I get a lot of that feedback on the evaluations from students.
Tacey Ann Rosolowski, PhD :
Yeah. How wonderful.
Wenonah Ecung, PhD:
And also my context, because I'm able tolike in Policy, I'm able to bring in guest speakers when we're talking about healthcare, or when we're talking about lobbying. I'm able to bring in people that have actuallythat are lobbyists. And it becomes real for them.
Tacey Ann Rosolowski, PhD :
How very neat. Is there anything else? Well, let me ask you a different question. We've talked a lot about the professional side. Is there something that you'd like to share to kind of flush out who's the person behind all the roles? Is there a favorite book, or a favorite activity, or place? A hero or heroine? (laughter)
Wenonah Ecung, PhD:
I guess my heroine is my mom. And it wasn't becauseinstead of stating it in a negative way, I'll say it in a positive. It was because she was a very strong woman. She wasn't always the best mom. My mother was an alcoholic. So she wasn't always present, I mean emotionally present to me. But her resilience demonstrated for me that no matter what I came up against, there was sunshine on the other side. I could move through it. When I look back at my life now, and I've had some challenges, some tribulations, but I wouldn't change any of them. I moved through them sometimes oblivious to what was going on. Some days I'd look back and think, how did I make it through the day? And then I realized that'snot how, isn't the important question. There is no question. What's important is the fact that I made it through the day. And I think that comes from what I saw her go through. And then how she did become present later in life when she got through that part of her life. So she would be my heroine. Yeah. And then I always like to talk about my two gifts, and those were my two girls.
Tacey Ann Rosolowski, PhD :
And their names?
Wenonah Ecung, PhD:
Blair Elizabeth Nelson and Britt, B-R-I-T-T, Elyse, E-L-Y-S-E, Nelson. And Britt will be 28, and Blair will be 33 next month. So, yeah. So they're my legacy.
Tacey Ann Rosolowski, PhD :
They're your legacy. What legacy do you feel you left at MD Anderson?
Wenonah Ecung, PhD:
I hope one of discipline, but with extreme caring, grounded in a foundation of integrity. Yeah. That's it.
Tacey Ann Rosolowski, PhD :
Is there anything else you would like to add?
Wenonah Ecung, PhD:
No. I've enjoyed talking to you during these sessions, and sort of taking the journey through.
Tacey Ann Rosolowski, PhD :
Yeah. It's been really, really interesting. And I'm grateful to you, taking the time, really.
Wenonah Ecung, PhD:
Thank you! I just hope I haven't been boring.
Tacey Ann Rosolowski, PhD :
No! Not at all.
Wenonah Ecung, PhD:
I think of all the people you've interviewed, and it's, like, where do II don't know.
Tacey Ann Rosolowski, PhD :
It's always just such a new perspective on the institution. I feel like I'm always going into a new corner of a labyrinth. It really
Wenonah Ecung, PhD:
I could see that.
Tacey Ann Rosolowski, PhD :
Yeah. So thank you very much for your time.
Wenonah Ecung, PhD:
Oh, it's been my pleasure, Tacey.
Tacey Ann Rosolowski, PhD :
And for the record, I'm turning off the recorder at about two minutes of three.
Recommended Citation
Ecung, Wenonah B. PhD and Rosolowski, Tacey A. PhD, "Chapter 16: A PhD and Teaching Leadership Theory and Policy after Retirement" (2017). Interview Chapters. 704.
https://openworks.mdanderson.org/mchv_interviewchapters/704
Conditions Governing Access
Open
